World Ship Society - ANNOUNCEMENTS - Enquiries Board
From time to time, we get enquiries of a general nature concerning ships or shipping companies. We seek knowledgeable readers who can answer the questions posed. If you can help, please write directly to the enquirer, with a cc to the webmaster@worldshipsociety.org (Please add the words "WSS Web Enquiries Board + [subject no. i.e. 2009-001]" to the subject line.)
Although we welcome enquiries from members and non-members alike, research can at times be very time consuming, so we ask that non-members of the World Ship Society consider a small donation to be put toward the operation of our Chatham Library facility, in Kent England. Members on the other hand can donate if they wish, but such enquiries are considered a benefit of membership. Donations can take the form of pound sterling cash, Canadian dollars, US dollars, Euro cash, GBP cheque, CDN$ cheque, US$ check, Internatioanl money order (all of which should be payable to the "World Ship Society"), or details of a Visa or MasterCard authorisation) — and sent c/o the webmaster at the following address:- WSS, 701-1011 Beach Ave., Vancouver, BC, V6E 1T8 Canada.
Latest enquiries are posted at the start of the listings
2012-001. I found a leaf painting, ca. 1890s, made in Cape Town of SS CHELYDRA. It shows an H on her funnel and I have managed to find out that she was built in Sunderland by Thompsons for Cuthbert Hutchinson. Would anyone be able to help me with more information about her, especially if she made any voyages to Cape Town. Wolfgang Ansorge. ansorge@talktalk.net
2011-008. I read a report that in 1956 the crew of the cargo steamer RHAPSODY sighted a huge turtle off the south coast of Nova Scotia with an all white shell. It measured 60 feet long and 40 feet wide. I would be interested in contacting any surviving members of the RHAPSODY to read their accounts of the incident and I am also interested in any other giant turtle sightings off the East Coast of Canada. See http://forteanzoology.blogspot.com/2009/02/father-of-all-turtles.html for more information on the RHAPSODY sighting. All correspondence to Richard Muirhead at richmuirhead@ntlworld.com
2011-007. On a Sunday, April 29th 1956, my wife and I boarded a Norwegian cargo-passenger ship in Los Angeles. Its name was FERNFIELD. I am presently working on a memoir of our voyage around the world which began in L.A. as two of the 12 passengers. The voyage on board the FERNFIELD from L.A. via San Francisco, Pusan (Busan), Yokohama, Taiwan to Hong Kong was one of our most treasured segments of the whole trip. Referring to Lloyd's Register of Ships, the FERNFIELD is listed as having been built by Cantieri Navali Riuniti Adriatico (now Fincantieri) in Montefalcone in 1948. It was owned by the Norwegian Line Fearnley & Eger, Oslo (1869 - 1969). Would anyone be able to help with suggestions where I might be able to find some photos of the ship and any other memorabilia, as well as if the ship has been scrapped or is still in existence. Thank you. nick.klepper@blueyonder.co.uk
Response 1. From our Chatham Librarian. The FERNFIELD was sold to d'Amico Societa di Navigazione a.r.l., Italy in 1967 and renamed MASSIMINO D'AMICO. With IMO number 5114105 and a final grt of 9400, she was sold to Taiwan shipbreakers and left Genoa 24.4.80, arriving at Kaohsiung prior to 3.6.80. I have no idea where you might obtain any memorabilia of the FERNFIELD, but if you do a search of the Internet for MASSIMINO D'AMICO you will find some photos of her with that name as well as some of her as FERNFIELD.
2011-006. I am seeking information on an Italian ship, the MARIA THERESA, which sank in 1864 on the Long Sand Thames Estuary. My gt grandfather received a silver medal from the King of Italy for rescuing the crew. Judy. judithwesterdale@btinternet.com
2011-005. I am looking for any piece of information about a capsized ship. 50 years ago, which was carrying members of a circus from El Salvador, Central America to Panama. My Mother would like to know if her youngest sister, Donita Ester Eraza was in this capsized ship. We have never known what happened to her - if she is still alive and well, or dead. Rina. r.cruz463@btinternet.com
2011-004. Having read your Enquiries Board section I am more than happy to make a donation if you can answer the following question.
I am researching the story of an RNAS pilot during WW1. He was British but his family was living in California on the outbreak of WW1. My subject was a radio operator on the SS MATZALAN, and refused to send a message to the SMS LEIPZIG — MATZALAN was supplying coal to the cruiser. The details are still cloudy and I am working on them. Anyway to cut my story short. MAZATLAN was previously (until March 1914) a 'Norwegian steamer' JASON, and later (November? 1915) became EDNA. EDNA was later captured by HMS NEWCASTLE in 1916 - date unknown. Ownership details as MAZATLAN and EDNA are not clear but may have been bought by German Embassy (Mexico and USA) funds... I am seeking the details of the launch date, technical details, and ownership whilst known as JASON, and EDNA's ultimate fate. A photo would be the icing on the cake. Hoping for an answer. Regards, Ian Burns.
If anyone can help answer these questions would they kindly reply to the following address: jenianburns@sympatico.ca
and so there is not much I can add to that part of the saga, as it is far more detailed than anything I have access to in our WSS Library.
However I can add quite a bit to "Jason"s overall history, with the following being just an initial brief precis.
Built 1903 by Laxevaags, Bergen, for A/D Jason, Norwegian flag, 1783grt, and sold by them to become "Mazatlan".
"Edna" was renamed "Polgarth" by the UK's Shipping Controller and managed by Cunard (which is possibly why the courts said she was lost!). By 1920 she was back under US registry as "Edna" again and remained under Sudden & Christenson's ownership until about 1933.
She is not listed in the 1935 Lloyds Register.
Hope this brief initial precis is of some use.
Alan Watt Chatham Librarian World Ship Society Ltd.
2011-003. I am researching the voyage made by CHARTLEY CASTLE (322 tons) under Captain Owen which sailed from London Basin around 25th January 1849 for Sydney arriving around 8th June 1849. She called in at Rio on the way. She had a crew of 16 and 7 saloon class passengers and 4 steerage. I have the passenger list. I am most interested to learn of the contents of the sixteen crates of luggage belonging to Henry Flevelle (steerage) if it is available. I am not a member but will be pleased to contribute to any expenses. Thanking you in anticipation. John Anning john.jabus@hotmail.co.uk
Response 1. Hi John, I did some searching of the Internet and I presume you are trying to discover what nautical/meteorological instruments were in the cases shipped by Henry Flavelle. The WSS is concerned with the ships themselves rather than individual items of cargo. Anyway it seems doubtful that any such records exist - even if there are Customs declarations, etc., I suspect that the packages would be collectively noted as personal effects or scientific instruments or whatever.
Regarding the "Chartley Castle"s voyage, the only information I have discovered is that the mails would have probably been loaded at Gravesend on 1st February 1849, she sailed from the "Downs" on 8th Feb, was at Rio on 12th April and arrived at Port Jackson (Sydney) on 18th June after a voyage of 137 days. However another website mentions her sailing on 11th February!
From our library copy of the 1849 Lloyds Register, "Chartley Castle" was surveyed at London in January 1849 for a voyage to Sydney, and at the time of survey her Master was R. Griffiths. However the register is updated (date of update unknown) amending the Master to H. Owen who was mentioned on the internet as being her master at Sydney. She was wooden barque of 322 tons old measurement, 382 tons new measurement (the criteria changed on 1.1.1836), built at Teignmouth in 1842 and owned by "Bartlett &", and her port was Exeter.
I don't think the WSS can help you much more, apart from a fuller history of the ship which is not really your interest.
Alan Watt Chatham Librarian World Ship Society Ltd
2011-002. Hi. I wondered if anyone could give me any information about the s.s. PORT STEPHENS - in particular, routes, cargo, etc. I am researching my family history and have discovered that my great grandfather was the 3rd engineer on this ship between about 1903 - 1905. He is listed on crew and passenger lists on this vessel. Unfortunately, he accidently drowned whilst in Port Hunter, NSW in 1905 - I assume when the ship was docked there. Hoping you can help, regards, Helen Fletcher lhbf@talktalk.net
2011-001. WSS member Mike West is continuing his search for a number of Canadian-built WWII ships. If you can help, write to Mike at 15 West Mount, Decoy, Newton Abbot, South Devon, TQ12 1DL, United Kingdom. No e-mail.
2010-013. A member in England has asked an interesting question about ship tonnages. "Can you tell me what unit of measurement you use on the ships records in the Marine News magazine? Is it Gross Tonnage/Deadweight (for Bulk Carriers)/Net Tonnage or Displacement?" Contact Ralph Tonkin at ralphtonkin@aol.com
Response 1. From the WSS Chairman — All warship tonnages (in Marine News and elsewhere) are always quoted as real tons (or tonnes - the so-called metric ton) - i.e. the actual weight of the ship as measured by DISPLACEMENT. The mercantile tonnages are either the wieght of the cargo (i.e. deadweight - typically used with bulk carriers) or gross & net. The two latter are essentially related to tax and charges for the transit of certain waterways or entrances into ports etc.
Response 2. Ralph's question has raised further questions about the difference between Gross tons and Deadweight tons. Capt. Cees de Keijzer, Chairman of the Rotterdam Branch, brings forth the following explanation. "Comparison of Tonnages in volume and in weight". He compares the differences between a VLCC (the AL-SHEGAYA) and a similar sized Cruise ship (the FREEDOM OF THE SEAS). Ton is originated from Tun, a wooden wine cask of 4 hogsheads, which is 210 Imperial gallons or 955 liters. The oldest known (13th century) ship's measurement was based upon the number of tuns of wine a vessel could carry in its hold (on the France to England trade). / Tonnage is the carrying capacity of a vessel measuered in tons - Displacement = the quantity of water a vessel displaces. / DWT (deadweight) = loaded displacement — Light displacement (MT ship) and a measurement of total weight a vessel is able to carry. — i.e. DWT is the weight in metric tons (1000 kg) of cargo, stores, bunkers, passengers and crew carried when loaded to her summer load line.
Tonnage in Volume — The GT (Gross Tonnage of a ship is neither the weight of a vessel nor a measurement of the amount of water it displaces, but a measurement of the vessel's volume. The GT generally comprises the moulded volume of all enclosed spaces of the ship. Until 1982 ships were measured in (Gross Register Tons), 1 GRT = 100 cft (cubic feet), which is equal to 2.83 m³. Nowadays measurement is in Gross Tons. The GT means all enclosed spaces in m³ x the factor 10.2 + 0.002 log V). V = content in m³. The NT (Net Tonnage) generally comprises the moulded volume of all cargo spaces on board. (Or say the money-earning spaces.)
Response 3. The following detailed explantion comes from Dr. Ian Buxton. Different tonnages, different measures, different purposes. If you are a port operator or a regulator, you want some general measure of ship ‘size’, to determine what port charges to levy and to decide what regulations should apply to bigger or smaller ships. Hence gross tonnage which has a long history, albeit called different things at different times. Despite its name, it is a measure of volume not of weight. It is calculated from the total enclosed volume of the ship above and below water, originally converted at a rate of 100 cu ft = 1 gross (registered) ton (not tonne), now by a formula that equates roughly to 2.83 cu metre = 1 gt. The latest form of measurement was used from 1984, removing most of the anomalies of the old system which allowed exemption from tonnage of huge spaces like decks of roll-on/roll-off ships. As every ship has a meaningful gross tonnage, you can aggregate figures for statistics like fleet size or shipping movements.
Net tonnage was developed from gross tonnage as a measure of earning capacity to account for the space used by cargo and passengers, by deducting non-earning spaces from the gross, e.g. machinery and crew accommodation spaces. Previously this was done deducting the corresponding volumes, but now there is a formula. This was meant to measure ‘ability to pay’ so was much used by port authorities, but it is little used today.
Compensated gross tonnage was developed to give a better measure than gross of shipbuilding output or capacity between shipyards or countries. A cruise ship or an offshore support vessel might have a value or shipbuilding work content per gt ten times higher than a simple tanker or bulk carrier, so summing gt alone gives a misleading impression for output of a shipyard building more complex types. A series of factors has been agreed for each ship type which effectively multiply gt, though it is actually a formula. A factor of 1 applies to a basic cargo vessel of about 10000 gt, down to about 0.3 for big tankers or up to about 3 for ferries.
If you are a cargo ship owner or charterer, you want to know a ship’s carrying capacity. Hence the use of deadweight which is the total variable load a ship can carry, i.e. cargo plus fuel plus water, stores etc. This will be the maximum load calculated to maximum permissible draught. For tankers and bulk carriers the maximum cargo weight is over 90% of dwt, so it is a good measure of ‘size’ for such vessels, either individually or in aggregate statistics, e.g. fleet size or shipbuilding order book. So this is a measure of weight, today in tonnes of 1000 kg, previously in long tons of 1016 kg.
If you are a shipbreaker, you want to know the weight of material in the empty ship, hence light displacement tonnage or more simply lightweight. As you would expect, empty weight plus variable load equals all-up weight, or in naval architectural terms:
Displacement is hugely important for naval architects, as they have to provide enough (buoyancy usually in sea water) to support both lightweight and deadweight. Hence it determines dimensions, hull form, stability, strength and performance.
While displacement (calculated from Archimedes principle and the total immersed volume of the hull) is not normally published for merchant ships, it is the usual measure of size for warships. Sometimes full load displacement, sometimes ‘standard’ displacement which deducts fuel etc from full load, as defined by the Washington Treaty of 1922.
So every ship can have every one of the above measures, even though not all are published. For the 294m long 2007 cruise ship Queen Victoria the figures are:
Gross tonnage 90049 Net tonnage 50125 Compensated gross tonnage 102258 Deadweight tonnes at 7.9m draught 7685 Lightweight tonnes 38850 Displacement at 7.9m 46535
But not every measure is meaningful for every ship; it is a case of selecting the most appropriate tonnage for the ship type and the purpose in mind.
2010-012. My name is Robert and I have a small video company. I'm busy making a ducumentary about a wreck in the Red Sea. She lays in front of Port Sudan. Her name is before 1932 was Bahia Blanca and after she was owned by Italian people and her name was changed to mv Umbria. My question is, I'm looking for pictures or even film when she was still floating. This is very difficult because all the Umbria pictures I can find have 2 funnels. I have been diving with my camera on the Umbria I'm talking about only has 1 funnel. I hope a reader can help me or give me some e-mail or internet sites to get me farther with my project. Thanks Robert. Robert Hughan, E-mail address: info@goofyaquavideo.com
Response 1. As you have realised the two-funnelled ship is the Cunard Liner "Umbria" (1884-1910)! I eventually found photos of your vessel as SS (not MV) "Umbria" on http://visions.mzplongee.ch/crbst_13.html . There are small photos of her as "Bahia Blanca" under both German and Argentine flags in the WSS's own publication "The Hamburg South America Line" and the latter is copied onto websites including http://www.maritimes-archiv.com//biografie/b/bahia%20blanca%201912.htm Best wishes, Alan Watt Chatham Librarian World Ship Society
2010-011. The following question was presented to us in the hope that a reader can answer this obscure query, or can direct the reader to a source that may be able to respond. "I am researching the subject of early Canadian Pacific passenger liners. The first Manager of Steamships, Arthur Piers, was born in 1851 in England, and served for time as the secretary to Cornelius Van Horne, President of the CPR(1888 to 1899). I think that Piers went to "apprentice" with the "Ross" Line of Steamers in mid-1889. In mid-1891, he was called back to the CPR to begin his job as Manager. I have a copy of a letter he wrote on "Ross" line letterhead, East India Avenue, London. I am unable to find out anything about that company, only that it may have been associated with the Thistle Line. I believe that the Ross Line went defunct in 1893, due to London-Montreal-Quebec competition with the Alan Line. Would anyone have information?" Milo Hicks, Vancouver, BC Miloclassicyachts@shaw.ca
Response 1. Hi Milo, There were two Ross companies slightly involved in transatlantic passenger sailings, but whether they were connected or not I don't know. W. H. Ross & Co., 19 Brunswick Street, Liverpool, were the ones involved in the Thistle Line. William Ross & Co., 3 East India Avenue, London EC ran the King Line for a while around 1879 before becoming associated with Temperley until 1893. The London company had disappeared from Lloyds Register by 1895 (we have a few years gap before then). There is some very sparse information on Ross Line (as the London company seems to have traded) in Noel Bonsor's epic 5-volume "North Atlantic Seaway" in the late 1970's, but that is all I have been able to readily unearth. Hope the above is of some use. Best wishes, Alan Watt, Chatham Librarian, World Ship Society
2010-010. Member Don Anderson poses the following question — "I have my fathers cont.cert of discharge from 1934 to 1947. As you can imagine, the war years show "foreign" as destination. Could you steer me to a source who might help me to find if he was in convoy? Contact Don at donpolander@tiscali.co.uk
Response 1. Hi Don, Your father's continuous certificate of discharge should show the names and tonnages of his ships, plus dates he served on each. There is a huge website http://www.convoyweb.org.uk/hague/index.html which can be searched by Convoy number or Ship's Names which should be a good starting point for your search of his convoys. The website was started by WSS member the late Arnold Hague. Best wishes, Alan Watt, WSS Chatham Librarian
Response 2. Thanks for your response to my query about my dad's ships. Through the good offices of the WSS, esp. Kevin O'Donoghue, I have full histories of all his ships, and have managed to obtain photos of all but two, who were short lived; "La Cordillera" [167411] and "Empire Lake" [106791] Best wishes for the Festive Season, Don Anderson
2010-009. While researching the Canada archives website http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca, I found the following CPOS ships arriving Halifax NS with returning Canadian troops ONGAR (formerly Allan Line CORSICAN) (1922 renamed MARVALE) THISLEHURST (formerly CANADA) OSCAR formerly Allan LineORPINGTON (formerly Allan Line SCANDINAVIAN) I can find no record of any of these ship names. Were they temporary names used for trooping (unlikely) or possibly used during the transient period between Allan Line and Canadian Pacific ownership. Any help on this question should be directed to Ted Finch at mariners-l@efinch90.fsnet.co.uk
Response 1 from Alan Watt, Chatham Librarian. Hi Ted I don't think the names you can't identify are ships. The Allen Line names were still in use later, and I can find no record of any of them being officially renamed. As the "names" were taken from passenger lists it could well be that groups of returning ?wounded? servicemen were listed separately under the camp or hospital they originated from as a separate listing on the passenger manifest, and the records have been recorded without the actual ship's name. There are transcribing errors evident in the lists - "Thislehurst" should be "Chislehurst" and I think "Oscar" should be "Ongar". The names are all places on the outskirts of London where WW1 servicemen seemed to have been located - Orpington was the site of "No 16 Canadian General Hospital". There are a few more "ships" names in the WW1 transatlantic sailings listings which can't be found - probably for the same reason. Hope this is of some use. Alan Watt, Chatham Librarian World Ship Society
Response 2. from the original enquirer Hi Alan, Many thanks for your reply and the info contained. That seems to make perfect sense - the listings on the Canadian archives site are a bit misleading. It would seem that the servicemen from Ongar sailed on the Corsican, Orpington on the Scandinavian, etc. That seems to solve that query!! many thanks Ted
2010-008. Erik Bergman sends us this request for information. I am putting together a fleet history of Chr Hannevig being extremely active in the US during WW1. A book written about him here in Norway is stating that he sold 18 newbuilding contracts to Cunard. Would appreciate any information relating to identification of the hull numbers and yards involved. If you can help. please respond direct to Erik at bergmanus@gmail.com
2010-007. I am looking for information on the Russian cargo ship Vladimir Rusanov, in particular the date she left Newcastle upon Tyne (around April 1918) to sail to Archangel in Russia (date of arrival?). V. Rusanov called in Vardoe (Norway) to load barrels of herrings to be delivered to the Russian population in exchange of allied military materials stored in the harbour of Archangel. I thank you in advance
2010-006. Wojciech Wachniewski is interested in the history of Rederi Skou (in English). If you can point this reader in the right direction, please e-mail him at stary_wraq@wp.pl
Response 1. From Alan Watt, Chatham Librarian. Hello Wojciech. The WSS published a book on "Ove Skou" in 1982, and although it is now out of print we do have a secondhand copy which I could mail to you for a total of GBP10, including postage, etc. The book covers the company whose names, since 1945, were "...... Skou", which I presume is the company you are interested in. Unfortunately, we only take sterling, either a sterling cheque or else Visa or Mastercard cards. I await your reply. Best wishes Alan Watt, Chatham Librarian, World Ship Society
Response 2. From Wojciech. Hi, thanks for your kind answer. Do you happen to know any websites with data on Messrs. Skou? The matter is with them, that they were ex-owners of our former motor [?] vessel "Hugo Kollataj" [the name of the ship with them was m/v "Benny Skou"]. The Kollataj ex B Skou appeared in our motion picture based freely on the history of our famous submarine ORZEL (Eagle in English), featuring a German freighter "Schwerin", chased, halted and finally destroyed by the submarine after her escape from Tallinn. When the company still existed, I was fortunate enough to receive a table from them with all their ships pictured on it, names, tonnages and so on. First of all I am interested in learning to know, if the company still existed or not. Many thanks for your answer once more, Have a nice day. P/s. I am myself interested generally in maritime and naval affairs, knowing much of our Polish maritime history
Response 3. From Alan Watt, Chatham Librarian. I checked up in the WSS library today. The last ship with a "Skou" name - the "Baltic Skou", 85/21305 bulk carrier, was sold to "London Greeks in 1995 and renamed then.
Skou International of Copenhagen was still listed in the 1992/93 Lloyds Register as managers. By the 1993/94 edition the managers were Site International of Charlottenlund, Denmark, with the same Telex and Cable addresses. By the 1994/95 edition the managers were Tschudi & Eitzen International with the same postal, Telex and Cable address. But by 1995/96 the telex address answerback was changed to TEINT. Tschudi & Eitzen were originally Norwegian shipowners who were also still listed with an address in Norway. So it seems that Skou was taken over by Tschudi & Eitzen in about 1992.
Sorry I don't have any information about any Skou websites, and I can't help you any more about Skou..
We have a book about the "Orzel" in our library. Best wishes Alan
2010-005. Robert Rice sends us the following enquiry — Do you have any information on the following WW2 Japanese Cargo/Ammunition Ship? HIDE MARU / Official # 71794 / Gross Tons 7694.16 / Net Tons 4457.52. This ship left Japan in early April 1943 in a supply convoy to Truk Lagoon. It arrived there in late April. It was sunk at Truk Lagoon by US submarine on or about June 12th, 1943. I am looking for the following info on this ship:
Date of Manufacture?
Name of Company ship built by?
Name and location of shipyard?
Date of construction?
Date of launching?
Ship type / Model / classification?
Any info on this ship will be gratefully appreciated. Contact Robert at rice_5@rogers.com
Response 1. Some information about the Japanese cargo ship Hide Maru O/N 35845 (note:Hide Maru 7694 GT,O/N 71794, was built in 1954) 5181 GT, 8512 DW Dimensions: L 121.92 (397') B 16.15 (52'-6") D 9.45 (30'-8") Steam turbine engine Speed: 12-14.8 kt laid 09/08/1929 launched 12/02/1930 Completed 26/03/1930 Yard.162 at Harima Shipyard Ltd, Aioi, Japan for Tochigi Shoji K.K Torpedoed 10/06/1943 (2.43N, 152.0E Truk Island) by US submarine Silversides (SS-236) see http://www.combinedfleet.com/Hide_t.htm Best regards Alain Delbarre
2010-004. We received a request from Christine Cochran — Could anyone please tell me if it was common for the Portuguese Navigator ships to have figureheads on the prow/bow of the ships? Meaning, during the time of their empire. If you can help Christine, contact her at jccochran1411@yahoo.com
2010-003. I am looking for a photo of the ship SOUTHERNER. It departed from Liverpool arriving in NY on 21 April 1842 carrying immigrants from England, Scotland & Ireland. Alex S. Palmer ws the captain on this voyage. Thank you. Linda Radecki LRadecki@iinet.com
2010-002. I am researching the history of the West India & Pacific SS Co which I believe was sold to Leyland Line in 1900. I am particularly interested in the origins and ownership of the company. Are there any books which cover this company? Can anyone please help?
Apparently WI & P SS Co was an important concern pre-1900. Alfred Holt (Blue Funnel Line) sold a large part of the fleet to them in 1864 and they were a strong rival to Royal Mail Steam Packet Co in the West Indies trade. They sold out to Leyland Line in 1900.
Response 1. A response from our Chatham Librarian. I have been unable to find any books detailing the West India and Pacific SS Co's history at our Chatham Library. There are references to it in both of Duncan Haws' "Merchant Fleets in Profile" series covering Leyland Line and Blue Funnel Line as well as Noel Bonsor's epic "North Atlantic Seaway" but you have obviously found those for yourself, as nothing further about the company is mentioned in them.
As West India and Pacific was a Liverpool company perhaps the records of the Liverpool Nautical Research Society at the Merseyside Maritime Museum might be worth investigating. They are listed under "Maritime Archives and Library" on www.liverpoolmuseums.org.uk Alan Watt, Chatham Librarian World Ship Society
2010-001. A member in the U.S.A. has posed the following question. Does anyone have the particular Yard List? In 1909, Swan Hunter & Wigham Richardson at Wallsend-on-Tyne built a lighthouse tender named SIMCOE for use in Canada. It sank in 1917 in the Gulf of St. Lawrence. What was the hull number of this vessel? Grassyblue@aol.com
Response 1. A response from our Chatham Librarian. According to Lloyd's Register Appendix, Shipbuilder's Section, the yard number for your SIMCOE was 806. The WSS Yard Lists do include Swan Hunter, so an enquiry to that source as listed in January's Marine News should have given you the answer you wanted. Alan Watt, Chatham Librarian World Ship Society
2009-015. I am researching the life of my great-grandfather, specifically his experiences while working on the sailing vessel JOSEFA. She was a beautiful Hermaphrodite-Brig built in 1874 at Deering, Maine by George Russell. She was owned by the J.S. Winslow Shipping Co. and hailed from the port of Portland, Maine. Her official: #75697 Her dimensions: 133 x 30, 490 tons Last captain: Ephram R. Snow last seen leaving Sagua le Grande, Cuba bound for Philadelphia, PA, Mar-Apr 1889
Some of my findings so far: She had carried lumber from Portland, ME to New York City. She was used in the Caribbean trade, bringing Cuban sugar/ molasses to New York and most likely other NE ports as well. An 1877 reference shows she also hauled salt, still vital for the New England fisheries as well as other domestic and industrial uses.
On approximately May 1887 Arroyo, Puerto Rico she, her captain and crew were detained by the Spanish Gov’t. about some packages of cornstarch which were unaccounted for. There was an investigation and articles published in the NY Times; one: Dec. 28, 1888. Sometime in 1889 she departed from Philadelphia and set sail for Segua le Grande, Cuba. In April of that same year she departed from Cuba and headed for Philadelphia carrying her cargo of molasses and was never seen again.
I would like to ascertain when my great-grandfather worked on her and where she sailed to during that time. I would like to track her voyages and obtain crew lists and logbooks. I would like to find out what ultimately happened to JOSEFA – in the end.
2009-014. The following enquiry was sent to us from a reader in Southampton. Can anybody help answer his question? "My grandfather was the captain of SS ARENDAL when it was sunk by a U-boat on 18th September 1917. I am trying to locate the owners of the ship. Can you help or point me in the right direction?" If you can help, please reply directly to Mike Beed at mikeandhilary@onetel.net
Response 1. Alan Watt, our Chatham Librarian sends in the following:- Mike — Your "Arendal" was owned by Roberts, Browning & Co. Ltd. of Liverpool when she was lost. She was an iron screw steamer of 1387 gross tons built in 1885 by Earle's Co. Ltd,, Hull, as the British "Eastwood". Later she became the "Arendal" under the Norwegian flag. In 1917 she came under British registry again, and according to Lloyds Register her master then was C. Vermulen. I know nothing about Roberts Browning, but as they were a Liverpool concern the Merseyside Maritime Museum http://www.liverpoolmuseums.org.uk/maritime may be able to tell you more.
The World Ship Society library is mainly for Society members, but we do try and help non-members in return for a suitable donation.
2009-013. The following enquiry comes to us from Bill Tarbit via our website enquiries. "Am trying to trace a collier brig WILLIAMS whose Captain William Smith discovered the South Shetland Islands in 1819." If you can help Bill with his enquiry, write direct to him at btarbit@hotmail.co.uk
Response 1. This response comes from our Chatham Librarian, Alan Watt. Bill. I have checked our copies of Lloyds Registers (1816, 1821 and 1827-28) and found two possibilities which seem to be confused and maybe they are even the same ship!
"Williams" (or "William's" in 1827-28 edition!):- Brig, 216 tons, single deck with beams, built at Blythe 1812, 14 foot draft. In 1816 she was listed as "copper fastened", Master: Hdhough, Owner: Smith &C, surveyed at London for voyage to Lisbon. By 1821 she was "Sheathed Copper 1818", Master: Smith, "Some repairs 1818", Owner: W Smith. Surveyed at London for a voyage to "Ayr" 1818. By 1827 her Master was Jones, Owner: Kain, Surveyed at London for Coastal 1822.
"William":- Snow, 215 tons, built at Blythe 1811, 12 foot draft. By 1816 her Master was W. Smith, Owner: W. Strand. Surveyed at London for a voyage to Buenos Ayres. By 1821 she was a Ship, 216 tons, single deck with beams, "Sheathed Copper 1818", Master: W. Smith, Owner W.Strand. Surveyed at London for a voyage to Buenos Ayres. By 1826 her Master was Jones, Owner W. Strand. Surveyed at London for a voyage to Buenos Ayres 1826.
In those days the printer had to adjust the information to fit the columns (hence "Hdhough" for a much longer surname) and the abbreviation for the Survey Information column reads "Lo. B.Ayrs" meaning "At London for voyage to Buenos Ayres" (the spelling in those days). It might well be that the entry for "Williams" in the 1821 edition is a misprint for "B.Ayrs". It could also be that the two similar ships' details had become confused in the 1821 edition.
You may be able to get more information from any possible Blythe local Historical group - I presume it is the port in what was Northumberland. Hope the above has been of some use. Our facilities really exist only for our members' benefit although we do like to help others if we can and would appreciate a suitable donation in return. Best wishes Alan Watt Chatham Librarian (chatham.librarian@worldshipsociety.org) World Ship Society 274 Seven Sisters Road, Willingdon Eastbourne BN22 0QW
2009-012. I am trying to track down an image of the house flag of Haines Brothers house flag, the funnel of this Co. was black with a capital H in white. I would be truly appreciative if you can help me. One of their ships foundered in the English Channel about 1955. I think she was called the "Tressilian" but I'm not 100% sure about that. Thank you. Barry Howe, Retired A.B
Response 1. This response comes from J.L. Loughran, WSS Library and Archives - Ships' Liveries Section — Since the Hain flags are all fairly simple in design, I might as well tell you the whole story.
The Hain family bought their first vessel, the lugger "Dasher" in 1816, the company being founded eventually as Edward Hain & Son in 1878. The flag was plain red with white EH, the letters being a sans serif style. This lasted until 1937, by which time the firm had become Hain S.S. Co. Ltd.. The flag was still plain red, but the letter had become a single H. From 1948, the H was placed in a solid black square at the centre of the flag, replicating the funnel design, which had been black with a large white H throughout. In November1964, when Hain's had been a subsidiary of the P&O group for some time, it was merged within the group with James Nourse Ltd. to combine the group's tramping activities, as Hain-Nourse Management Ltd.. The funnel became a dark blue, the H being replaced by a HN monogram. The general pattern of the house flag was retained, but the colours changed: the flag was white, with a broad blue border all round, and the HN logo in red. This in turn ceased with the formation of the P&O Bulk Shipping division in 1973.
This may be more information than you asked for, but at least it covers the period when the "Tresillian" foundered.
Refer to http://worldshipsociety.org/2995.html for details of the ninth edition of "Brown's Flags and Funnels" which has been completely revised by WSS member Louis Loughran.
2009-011. Can anyone advise where information re: ship's numbers can be obtained? My Dad was on various fishing boats with PW (Padstow) numbers. I would like to put a name to the vessels. Please reply direct to John Billing herald1@tadaust.org.au
2009-010. Photos wanted. WSS member Mike West writes "I am looking for photographs of the following WWII built ships. HARLESDEN, 1942, HARPALYCE, 1943, HARDINGHAM, 1942 - all three owned by J & C Harrison, London. Also the EASTGATE, 1944 (ex-TREVIDER)." No e-mail address - Write: Mike West, 15 West Mount, Decoy, Newton Abbot, S Devon TQ12 1DL, United Kingdom. (make sure that your response to Mr. West includes a note that you are responding to a listing on the WSS website's Enquiries Board)
2009-009. Another enquiry from Allan Smith. Does anyone have access to the Mercantile Navy List and Maritime Directory ? (the following editions are in the library at the Maritime History Museum, Albert Docks, Liverpool) or the appendices giving crew details possibly Joseph Horobin, master, Middlesbrough. I am looking for info on the following vessel, and have some info from various editions of the list as follows:-
¤ 1937 No 106013 Lady Magdalen reg Middlesbrough 1919, Build Port of Glasgow 1896, formerly Clutha 11 (that's eleven) 45 tons net, 82 tons gross,
¤ 1914 ditto but reg Beaumaris 1904, still Lady Magdalen formerly Clutha 11
¤ 1947 and 49 Ditto reg Newport, Monmouthshire
¤ 1955 ditto reg Milford 1949
¤ 1971 not found in register
Can anyone fill in any gaps, when her name changed or when she was sold overseas or decommissioned? When she left Middlesbrough between 1937 and 47. My father in law says he went on board her when he was about 10 (1936) with his grandfather who was her captain, or is that the eyes of a proud grandson promoting him? (see previous enquiry 2008 -011)
In the 1901 Census 1. Joseph Horobin snr, Engineman Dredger no4, Tees CC age 64 2. Son - Joseph Horobin jnr, Tugboat engine man, Tees CC, age 48, reputed later to be master on ‘Lady Magdalene’ river ferry 3. Grand son John T Horobin Tugboat fire man, ‘Gilbertson’ of Preston moored in Midddlesbrough, Tees CC, age 25, 4. Grand son Joseph B Horobin Tugboat engine man, Tees CC, age 21,
1 & 3 found both at home and in vessels returns “ashore” 2 & 4 found at home but not on vessels returns
In 1891 census 5. Son - Alfred Horobin, Tugboat engine man, mate, age 31, died 1897 6. Son – William Horobin, Tugboat labourer, Tees CC, age 24, unknown in 1901 AT home with no1 above
Response 1. Apr 30, 2009 from our own Chatham Librarian "Lady Magdalen" was originally the Clyde passenger ferry "Clutha No. 11". From various sources I have found out the following, mainly additional to your information:-
Built by Russell & Co., Port Glasgow, Yard No. 398, for The Trustees of the Clyde Navigation, Glasgow, 1896. Steel, screw steamer. Two 2-cylinder compound engines by Muir & Houston, Glasgow
1904 sold to The Mayor, Aldermen & Burgesses of the City of Bangor, Carnarvonshire, Registered at Beaumaris as "Lady Magdalen"
1919 sold to The Mayor, Aldermen & Burgesses of the Borough of Middlesbrough, Yorkshire, registered at Middlesbrough. Still thus in 1930
By 1934 , managing owner Frederick R. Less, Pembroke Dock, but still registered at Middlesbrough. Still thus in 1939
By 1947 still registered at Middlesbrough, Owners: British Conveyances Ltd., Newport Monmouthshire, Manager: John Freeguard, Newport Mon.
1947 registered at Newport, Monmouthshire
1949 registered at Milford
By 1957 owner Pembrokeshire County Council, Haverfordwest, Pembrokeshire.
? 1965 scrapped ?
The above is mainly taken from Mercantile Navy Lists of 1911, 1924, 1934, 1935, 1939, 1947, 1957 which are the only ones we have available at Chatham. It seems strange that although owned in Pembroke Dock you say she was still in Middlesbrough in 1936. The fact that she remained registered at Middlesbrough is not unusual, Mr. Lee problably didn't think it necessary to re-register her.
The World Ship Society deals with ships rather than people so we can't really help you with your ancestors.
Clearly from the ‘Lady Magdalen’ looks more like ‘Clutha 9’ than ‘Clutha 11’ The books quote 45 tons net, 82 tons gross – I am no judge – can anyone tell from looking at these 2 pics which vessel is more nearly that tonnage. I suspect an error in the first edition of the list that mentions her, which is propagated though the years. Or maybe an error in original documentation in transfer of ownership – who knows!
2009-008. MONIKA MUNKSHOLM. A question comes to us from Marcin Jaworek "I am looking for information for the Danish ship MONIKA MUNKSHOLM vel WEST STAR, especially details of building, technical data and information about crew and captain." marcin.jaworek@wp.pl
Response 1. Apr 27, 2009 from our own Chatham Librarian The vessel you are interested in is "Monica Munksholm".There is a lot of information (in Danish) on http://www.arminius-schiffe.de/bilder2.html including details of her building, ownership and loss. However from Lloyds Register she was 534grt, 1 hold, 2 hatches, 2 3-ton derricks. As "West Star" her grt was given as 500. The World Ship Society researches ships, not people, so I have no details of the crew nor her captain.
2009-007. NORONIC and HAMONIC. A member in the U.K. is looking for detail concerning the above mentioned ships. "I am looking for a reliable figure for the numbers of passengers which the two Canadian excursion steamers were certified to carry." Both were built in the early 1930s for the Canada Steamship Line. contact David at wildiow@talktalk.net
Response 1. Mar 28, 2009 from Skip Gillham. "HAMONIC which was built at Collingwood in 1909, is listed at 475 passenger capacity in my notes".
Response 2. Mar 29, 2009 from Gordon Turner "I have looked at about half a dozen reference books and have not gleaned much at all. However, Dana Thomas Bowen in "Love of the Lakes" (page 253) writes "the NORONIC has stateroom for five hundred and sixty-two passengers." This is confirmed in the company's 1921 brochure. The same brochure says that HAMONIC has acommodation for 332 passengers. I have studied several brochures from the years between the two World Wars and they all give the figures for berthed accommodation only."
2009-006. The webmaster is looking for your help. A member of the WSS handed me a lapel pin that he claimed was used some 30 years ago, but I had not seen one before, and I know of no one who has. I am aware of two different lapel pins that we have sold over the years, but this new-found one is quite unique. Instead of the usual 'pin' on the back, this one has a "C"-shaped claw that I presume would be inserted sideways into a button hole. Does anyone have any details of when this pin was in use, or who used it. Any information on lapel pins would be appreciated. webmaster@worldshipsociety.org
This is the pin in question. It appears to be made of a gold-coloured pot metal, ¾ inches wide by 1 inch high, blue and gold enamel, with "C" configuration on the reverse.
This traditional pin was sold by the Society through its Shop for many years. Blue and gold enamel on gold-coloured backing with pin clasp.
This unusual pin has surfaced, but again it is not widely known to exist. Blue enamel on silver base. It appears to be made of silver, or silver plate (this copy now badly tarnished).
I would like to write up the history of such items as our 3-ship logo, the various lapel pins, blazer badges, house flags and other merchandise items that have been offered to members over the years, and am asking for your help. See also the section HOME - Society History http://worldshipsociety.org/30322.html
I am aware that some branches may have produced similar items for their own members, and I would like to include these as well. Contact the webmaster@worldshipsociety.org if you can help.
2009-005. Your webmaster again - looking for historical details about various branches of the WSS. I have just added a well-written 'potted' history of the New South Wales Branch, and would like to include similar stories from other branches. If you know of any existing histories, please forward a copy on to me so that I can add the history to that branch listing — even if the branch no longer exists.
2009-004. An enquiry from the Simon's Town Museum in South Africa "I am trying to help one of our visitors with information on a ship called HARRIET which disappeared off the Southern Coast of South Africa around 1848. The captain was W. Messum. Any information or advice would be appreciated." Please respond direct to Ms. Cathy Salter-Jansen at stmuseum@mweb.co.za
2009-003. An enquiry about the schoonerCRISPIN. "My ancestor George Denyer came to Australia on the small schooner CRISPIN - leaving England 1852, arriving Port Philip in 1853. Do you have a listing for such a vessel and if so would you be able to provide info re same and/or illustrations or advice on where to look? I would appreciate any help given. Jenny Little" jenanloz@hotmail.com
Response 1. Mar 14, 2009 - a response from our WSS Chatham Librarian. I have found a CRISPIN in Lloyds Register which is possibly the ship you ask about. In the 1852 edition:- "CRISPIN", Schooner. Master: J. Walker. Tonnages: 123/114. Built 1841 at Bracehaven, Fife. Some repairs carried out in 1848 & 1850. Owner: R. Spence. Port: Dundee. Class A1 (8+3), surveyed 1849. Destined voyage: Leith to Baltic. The 1853, 1854 & 1855 editions show additional information. She is not listed in the 1856 edition. It therefore seems possible that she was sold in 1852 to J. Borrie for the voyage to Australia you mention and then disappeared from Lloyd's records.
2009-002. The following enquiry was sent to us in hopes of an answer. "An ancestor, William Donald Clark, was First Engineer on S Laureldene. His final voyage left Cardiff 27 April 1899 and he died on board 10 miles SE of Malta on 11 July 1900 with suspected typhoid nearing the end of an extensive journey. I have been told that there may be an obituary within your archives. Do any readers have further information? I have obtained records of the voyage from Newfoundland. I would be most grateful for any help you can give me. Mrs J.M. Wade" j.mwade@tiscali.co.uk
2009-001. A reader from Kent is looking for some information about a relative. Steve Glover steve@sjglover.co.uk is asking for help in locating any information on Captain Thomas Glover, who died on the SS PACIFIC in Smyrna, Asia Minor in 1868.
Response 1. Jan 18, 2009 - a response from our WSS Chatham Librarian. The World Ship Society is for those interested in ships rather than people, and so we don't have much information on the latter. However, Lloyds Register used to note the Master's name against each ship's entry. I tried to check your SS PACIFIC for the only steamship mentioned in the 1867 edition (1467 tons, built 1854 at London) has no mention her Master nor any owners! There is a useful publication available which would give you various avenues of research into your relative, covering such areas as ship's logbooks and Lloyd's Captain's Registers. It is "Maritime Information" by Roy Fenton, Nuala Briody and Mike Macdonald, published by the Maritime Information Association, 2004, ISBN 1 901703 62 2. I would assume your local library would be able to locate a copy for your to borrow. Alternately, as I see you live in Kent, perhaps it would be convenient for you to visit the World Ship Society's Library and Archive located in the Chatham Historic Dockyard, where, for a suitable donation (as you are not a WSS member) you could view our copy of "Maritime Information" and obtain some more specific information about the "PACIFIC" (if it is in fact the one mentioned above). The WSS Library & Archives is not necessarily open every day so you would need to arrange to visit at an agreed date and time.
From time to time, we get enquiries of a general nature concerning ships or shipping companies. We seek knowledgeable readers who can answer the questions posed. If you can help, please write directly to the enquirer, with a cc to the 
This is the pin in question. It appears to be made of a gold-coloured pot metal, ¾ inches wide by 1 inch high, blue and gold enamel, with "C" configuration on the reverse.
This traditional pin was sold by the Society through its Shop for many years. Blue and gold enamel on gold-coloured backing with pin clasp.
This unusual pin has surfaced, but again it is not widely known to exist. Blue enamel on silver base. It appears to be made of silver, or silver plate (this copy now badly tarnished).